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  • Math Mom: Success?

    By Della Fenster June 18, 2008 10:02 pm

    Last Friday, an impromptu conversation in the mailroom at my University jolted my pulse into my aerobic zone. I might have even gone anaerobic, but I am not sure.

    This cardiovascular exercise without movement began when one of my closest colleagues suggested to me that his life as a father with a stay-at-home wife was not really all that different from the life I live. I've replayed this conversation several times in my mind, wondering how we reached this point in our discussion in the first place, and, as you might suspect, wondering how this clever, insightful colleague of mine could really imagine the validity of his observation.

    At first I wanted to ask him some pressing questions. What was it like to teach with a sick baby on your hip? What was it like to miss a critical meeting because the elementary school called? What was it like to write your talk AND stock the fridge, do the laundry and prepare a master schedule before you left town? I refrained. I felt sure I misunderstood his point. And maybe I did.

    I've thought about this conversation ad infinitum in the 100 hours since it took place. Eventually, no matter how I parcel out my thoughts, I return to the simple question of: why? Why does it matter that he understands there is a difference in our lives?

    I'm not sure I have an answer. Somehow, though, I want him to know that there is a difference. If he visits his child's preschool, he will be lauded as an extraordinary dad. If I visit my child's preschool, I am shirking my professional responsibilities. He exercises every day at lunchtime. Lunchtime? That is a compound word I learned in second grade that has almost no meaning in my adult life, unless, of course, I am enjoying lunch with a student. Exercise? If I want to exercise, I have to awaken in time to be back home by 6:30 a.m. The pressing demands on my schedule do not permit a break in the middle of the day. I hear him practice his professional talks in his office two or three days before he attends a conference. He never hears me practice my talks since, by now, I usually finish them a night or two before a conference begins and practice them after midnight or, worse yet, on the plane ride to the meeting.

    Still, why does it matter that he understands this difference? I still don't have an answer. We both have roughly the same professional responsibilities and certainly the same standards of evaluation. I just take advantage of the flexible time schedule that comes along with this profession a lot more than men with a stay-at-home wife.

    But I do worry about the role model I set for my students. Am I really a role model when I have to race off to take care of an unexpected situation that arises? Am I really a role model when I let it slip that I didn't get much sleep last night? Am I really a role model when I have to put their project in a queue that includes not only professional responsibilities ahead of it but a ballet recital too?

    Then again, would a really meaningful role model make it look easy? To this day, I regret the model I created at the University of Virginia when, as the first woman graduate student or faculty member in the department of mathematics to have a baby during the academic year (there was only one woman on the faculty at the time), I delivered my baby on a Sunday and returned to the classroom the following Tuesday. I felt heroic at the time. Now I feel uncomfortable for the women who had complications or other difficult situations who came after me.

    It occurs to me now, as I've worked through these thoughts by writing about them, that my colleague may have actually paid me a large compliment by seeing no difference in our lives. Maybe, after all, that is a measure of success?

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Comments on Math Mom: Success?

  • Posted by PhilosopherP on June 19, 2008 at 8:55am EDT
  • I think it is vital that you let him know, gently, how different your lives are. It is a simple fact of academia, and mathematics and philosophy in particular, that men like your colleague set the standards for hiring, tenure and promotion. Making an assumption that the average faculty member has a stay at home spouse to handle the details is simply wrong. Men and women both (should) have to juggle parenting/ life issues with academics. He shouldn't be allowed to hold the faulty assumption that his life is similar to your own...

  • Posted by Libby on June 19, 2008 at 9:35am EDT
  • I'm with PhilosopherP, Della, though I think you're also right that this is a measure of your success. And I'd still be replaying the conversation in my head, too, if it had been me. What on earth can he have been thinking?

  • Different perspectives
  • Posted by Marybeth Mitts on June 19, 2008 at 9:55am EDT
  • Your colleague may think there is no difference in your lives because he may assume you make decisions the same way, with the same input. If his child is sick, he assumes his stay-at-home wife will stay with the child at home all day (catering to their needs and illness) or pick the child up from school and deal with the illness from that point on. He probably doesn't factor that into his calculus of your life, because you are like him--at work, teaching, with the students. Maybe it never dawns on him to put the ballet rectial before preparing for the conference because the conference is part of his professional responsbilities and his status whereas the ballet recital has no factor in that equation either. His stay-at-home wife will attend the recital if he is too busy preparing for the conference. To him that may be a win-win situation. To you that is not even a consideration. We all have our perspectives. None of them are wrong, but they are different and not equal. To be understood by all parties, all the factors in the equation must be taken into account: x + y = z, but 2x + 6y is not z, too.

  • Posted by The BigDog on June 19, 2008 at 11:30am EDT
  • That's why salaries for women in academia tend to be less than those of their counterparts. Women tend to have other responsibilties that they need to take care of that - whether they care to admit it or not - do not allow them to commit their full time attention to their academic job. I'm not saying that this is bad. Rather, the opposite is true. Women shouldn't expect to get paid the same when they are perfroming a second - and more important - job at the same time.

  • wow.
  • Posted by Marybeth Mitts on June 19, 2008 at 12:25pm EDT
  • Big Dog, I'm not sure I agree with your 59 cent assessment of why a woman academic receives less than a male academic for (surely) the same amount of work. She doesn't teach less classes or fewer students and she CERTAINLY doesn't get compensated for her "more important" job. I'm really so sick of lame justifications, like yours, for women receiving less pay than men for the same job. That's just soooo 1960s.

  • Posted by Melissa on June 19, 2008 at 12:35pm EDT
  • Unless he knows for a fact that a) you have a spouse, and b) your spouse is a stay-at-home partner, the equation, as the above points out, doesn't add up. If it were me, I'd ask him, somewhat bluntly, what he meant by his comment. And then, if he really is as clueless as his comment makes him out to be, I'd gently (or not so gently, depending on how little sleep I'd gotten) explain why he is so very wrong.

  • moonlighting
  • Posted by DOA on June 19, 2008 at 12:50pm EDT
  • According to Big Dog's argument, then, academics of either gender who take on critical consulting or advisory roles, "shouldn’t expect to get paid the same when they are performing a second — and more important — job at the same time."
    Please.

  • Math mom
  • Posted by cheddar on June 19, 2008 at 1:55pm EDT
  • I guess as conversations go, this one would be irritating. I don't have the family situations of each of these bloggers memorized. Is Math Mama a single parent? Does she have a working spouse with a career with flexible hours? A little more info could help put this conversation in context.

  • Women need a wife too
  • Posted by susu , Dr on June 20, 2008 at 12:35pm EDT
  • we did a survey on career trajectories of scientists and engineers in research extensive universties, and found the significant differences between male and female regarding they having stay-home spouse. Most female scientists are married with professioanl spouses and are entailed with heavy household burden, while male scientists are more likely to be relieved of household chores.
    The difference constitutes a big barrier for women scientists to pursue the most effective career path, characterized by spending plenty of time socializing with their peers, enjoying a large amount of time without worring about children or other family issue and so.
    The most advantaged group is those junor female scientists with kids at home. There are not many choices for them, but prusue carreers with heavy shackels.

  • Ideal Worker Norms
  • Posted by Prof on June 20, 2008 at 5:30pm EDT
  • Regarding BigDog's comment, academic women’s “full-time attention” may not be committed to their careers, but this is not relevant to the issue of salaries unless these women are doing less than what is expected by the demands of their positions. I would guess that most women are fulfilling their parenting duties on top of, not instead of, their academic commitments. This poster seems to be operating under very gendered assumptions related to what has been called the “ideal worker” norm: the idea that all of a professional’s time and effort will go toward his/her career. Expectations for tenure and promotion (and, thus, assessments of merit and standards for salaries) need to be set so that all working parents can reach them. We cannot expect and reward a pattern of work that assumes a “supporting” spouse at home who does all of the cooking, cleaning, and childcare (which is what BigDog is implicitly suggesting).

  • Posted by knezmom on June 23, 2008 at 10:00am EDT
  • When our younger daughter was 3, she had a special need that prevented her from going to daycare (she had attended daycare part-time at my school, but it was a disaster for her). To make a really long story really short, my husband quit his job to stay home with her. While he had heard about the "parenting issues" I had (I had been home, then worked part-time, then back full-time), he didn't really "get it" until he was in the trenches day-in and day-out. I'm not surprised that this guy said something so ridiculous. You really have to experience it to understand.

    NOW, what I find so funny, is that darling hubby thinks I don't understand what it's like to be home! But, to give him tons of credit, our now 7- and 11-year olds are doing great because of him!