Credentials

It is a sad and unfortunate event, but “fraud” would be a more apt characterization of what Ms. Jones did than “misreprestation.”

Anne-Marie McCartan, at 8:45 am EDT on April 27, 2007

It is unclear what her great “Experience” was that would justify ignoring the fact that she lied. It seems that she was more of a pundit, and did little more than promote herself. All that stuff she told the kids about not pushing themselves is taken with a grain of salt, anyway. People that want to succeed push themselves.

In fact, I think it is sort of sick that an administrator at a top college that prides itself on the achievements of its students was telling kids not to worry about achievement.

Larry, at 9:05 am EDT on April 27, 2007

Yes, she lied and she shouldn’t have done so. And yes, that is an offense for which one should be terminated. But the fact that she rose through the ranks to become admissions chief indicates that she knew her craft and points out, once again, the imperfect match between abilities and credentials. I knew a guy once who was a well-respected PR director for a prestigious liberal arts college until it was discovered that he had never graduated from college. He was fired. The PR post at that college has been something of a revolving door ever since as people with good credentials move in and out.

Richard, at 9:35 am EDT on April 27, 2007

Pretty clearly she has to lose the job. Lying about one’s credentials is not a forgiving offense.

That said, I find it interesting that a job that required these credentials for hiring could be fulfilled so ably by someone who had none.

Perhaps it’s time we learned how to look at the person, not the paper.

Stephen Downes, at 9:35 am EDT on April 27, 2007

Lying dean

Should we judge academic candidates by more than credentials? Of course, and our unions have been supporting fairer compensation for non-tenure track faculty, but the administration has been adamament in its position of “terminal degree” needed. On the other hand, we consider lying on credentials to be adequate cause to dismiss.

Fred Flener, UPI Local 4100, at 10:00 am EDT on April 27, 2007

Credentials -for what?

Experience versus credentials ... hardly worth debating and, generally speaking, it isn’t allowed to be debated —at least at the level where substantive change will result.

The most appropriate wording is experience OR credentials ... but then, too many in the academy don’t want to go there ... it’s not only a threat, it’s also beyond the scope of their comfort zone. It’s rather simple to verify a degree was attained, it’s a lot more arduous to evaluate whether the listed experience qualifys for the demands of a psoition.

As someone who has spent time in both the corporate and educational sectors, the right thing to do is to add the word OR as a qualifier for most (not all) positions.

Two quick examples: as you ponder the qualifications of the the person about to perform open heart surgery on you ... do the academic and medical degrees alone convince you?

If lying were the litmus test for whether someone remains employed or not, it’s hard to believe that many reading this passage would still be employed next week ... and, for sure, we’d have no operating branches of government.

Michael Chiaradonna, at 10:35 am EDT on April 27, 2007

Comical farce, MIT-style

The sad and shoddy saga of Marilee Jones would make a perfect routine for one of those Holday Inn Express advertisements.............where she proclaims to students, “I’m not really qualified as an Admissions Dean, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.”

The whole episode arouses more doubts about how careful and fact-checking MIT is about its other employees.

Chuck, at 11:10 am EDT on April 27, 2007

I’m always amazed when this happens in Higher Ed because we are uniquely qualified to verify degrees. Not only do we understand which degrees are “real” but we know where to go to check them. I can understand this happening out in the broader business world because often they don’t even know what “accredited” really means and I’d imagine some smaller firms don’t even know how to verify a degree.

But at MIT? A person who was prominent and wrote books, etc? I can’t help but wonder if more people were involved in covering this up.

MIchael, at 12:20 pm EDT on April 27, 2007

Credential Fraud

The academic credentials of administrators and faculty are rarely examined once past the hiring stage. Our campus recently institutionalized a background check on new faculty applicants. Their degree certificates must be officially stamped by the degree university in an envelope opening only by the hiring administrator. Authors of support letters for final candidates are contacted to verify authenticity of the letter and to ascertain if there is unwritten information that we should know about.

With cheating and plagiarism rampant among students, we should expect administrators and faculty to set an honorable role model.

Pacific Coast Prof, at 12:20 pm EDT on April 27, 2007

It is unbelievable to me that people defend this woman’s actions under the veil that she somehow served in her role more admirably than those with actual credentials. The underlying disdain is most disturbing. Those with post-secondary educational achievements have earned them. Certainly, there are varying levels of demonstrated performance throughout all levels in the workplace, but please do not insinuate that the post-secondary degrees are worthless.

I find it criminal that someone in her position LIED to get her job. She is supposed to be an educator. The education community SHOULD be held to a higher standard.

Here’s a suggestion: let’s get rid of grades, degrees, and all forms of competition, give everyone a big hug, and become an even softer, more docile nation.

John, at 12:35 pm EDT on April 27, 2007

Joe, The beauty of her job is nobody can objectively define “success.”

Larry, at 1:00 pm EDT on April 27, 2007

Sounds Familiar

While I don’t condone what Jones did, I understand why she did it. I, too, climbed the ladder of a major Massachusetts institution, coming in as a program manager and rising to Director level over the course of 6 years. I do not have a college degree (never finished), but was hired based on my 10 years of relevant experience, after a grueling interview process, where I received a grilling above and beyond the level that those with degrees are subject to. My achievements, experience and references were deemed suitable substitutes for the degree. Despite the fact that I was upfront with administration that hired and promoted me over the years, each day at work I felt as if I was hiding a deep dark secret. I lived in fear that my peers would respect me less if they found out I didn’t have the piece(s) of paper. If confronted, I never lied about my college education, but I certainly never offered up the fact that I didn’t complete it. Ultimately, this stress caused me to seek employement outside of academia.

My educated guess is that Jones made a somewhat unconsious decision to ride the lie as far as it would take her...knowing full well that the more time passed, the harder she would fall.

CFO, Former Director at (Major Massachusetts Institution), at 3:05 pm EDT on April 27, 2007

MIT Dean Claimed Unearned Degrees

To colleague Joe Of Two Minds. What does it tell us when someone lies about their credentials to land a job and successfully climbs the administrative ladder for the last 28 years? Sir, it tells me nothing except that she obtained her position through fraud and that is all that matters. Our academic arena is a world of “credentials” and “training". What has changed? She lied, no one checked and now she is an urban hero because she did good work. Give me a break!

My guess is that this world is full of able, enthusiastic, intelligent individuals who COULD succeed in positions were it not “credentials” that bar them from even applying for these positions. And, they have not lied to gain positions. She is a cheat and how can anyone reward that type of deception?

Carol Michelson, Association, at 3:15 pm EDT on April 27, 2007

WTF was she thinking! here is an awesome take on the situation from a college student http://collegecandy.com/2007/04/27/mit-maven-is-a-liar-liarface/

steve g, at 3:30 pm EDT on April 27, 2007

Up the Ladder

Richards comment regarding the potential lack of correlation between skill, credentials, and accomplishments needs to be viewed in the context of the higher education pecking order. The reality is that the MIT association is more of a factor in career advancement than any other. Claiming a relationship with a flagship, ivy league, tier one university will open doors, regardless of one’s actual ability. Get an entry level job at one of those institutions and you have a leg up on all those many thousands whose talents and credentials are devalued simply by virture of being applied at a community college, state university or be-it-ever-so-humble liberal arts college. I’ve had personal experience at both ends of this equation.

Scott

Scott, at 5:05 pm EDT on April 27, 2007

greg response

greg (in case you check this story even though it was a mis-post),

You’ll note that although FERPA allows the release of this information it does not require it. Many institutions choose not to to protect their image. Many institutions also require confidentiality agreements or non-disclosure agreements that should not be required of victims to discover the results of hearing that they have a right to hear.

sorry to continue the wrong conversation on this message board!

Concerned Alum, at 5:25 pm EDT on April 27, 2007

“Larry, what make you think or suggest that admissions/ enrollment professionals have no objective way to define success in their field. Have you ever heard of net tuition revenue.”

Where I’d agree with Larry is that at a school like MIT, she’d have to have been not merely unsuited to the job, but an absolute piece of work to have had an impact on tuition dollars. High school kids were going to toss a ton of applications to the university whether she was there or not; and the ultimate impact of her decisions (unless she starts picking students who are considerably inferior to before) would not be noticeable until years if not decades afterwards.

——

It says something that she was able to undertake this job without a college degree and yet, at minimum, appear to others in this office to be competent at it. On the other hand, she first gained work at MIT two decades before she took up her current position. I’d assume she had a lot of on the job training before she reached this point.

That’s an opportunity somebody else never had. There’s no way to give it to them and there’s no way to take a 30-year career of steady work and paychecks away from here.

I can understand how she might have been desperate for a job and it is easy to look at her situation and feel sorry for her—on the other hand, there likely was someone more qualified than her who didn’t get the opportunity she did because she lied. There’s someone who may have been better at this job. Because that person doesn’t have a name and a face attached to them is no reason to direct most of our sympathy towards the person who does.

This is also merely the instance where she was caught, and considering that she got away with this big of a lie, it’s impossible to know how many smaller ones that she might have used to get where she is.

I understand how people may remember instances where they were desperate for a job and would be willing to cut her slack because of this. This person took a job away from somebody who was more qualified, though, solely because she padded her resume—keep in mind the possibility you didn’t get one of those jobs you really needed, because another person (who was less qualified than you, but willing to lie to get ahead) did the same thing.

SB, at 5:25 pm EDT on April 27, 2007

Not why, but how it was done

A long-term employee, who has done nothing but good work for the institution for many years, deserves better than public humiliation as she is legitimately removed from her job for having lied about her credentials. I am one who thinks long time experience and performance should trump credentials under almost any circumstance, except this one. She shouldn’t have lied and perpetuated the lie. But her departure didn’t need to be so cruelly public. There are many ways to deal with situations like this that don’t end up on the front page of the New York Times.

anonymous, at 11:15 pm EDT on April 27, 2007

30 year old lie......who cares.

this woman apparently did her duties well despite her fictitious “degrees". but i’m sure so many more upper level administrative officials were not so honest about their backgrounds as well. to put the spotlight on this just deflects our awareness to a pintpoint rather than looking at the overall picture in the larger schema of university politiks and the educational hoax. do you want to know what students are doing in most colleges and universities?? they get drunk, have fun, and hopefully pass class. there’s more problems occuring with the level of education than the pasts of the administrative directors.

jezebel, mit dean at mit, at 6:45 am EDT on April 28, 2007

This lady is certainly not uneducated in the ways and means required by universities. Alas!

Michael Pyshnov, A street-smart lady, at 11:50 am EDT on April 28, 2007

Unearned Degrees

Jones has earned a much more than a degree on the job. Probably, no purpose is served by belittling her Positive contribution to Education at this point of time. She probably would have been an achiever in what her interest was, just as Bill Gates as a drop out achieved so much with his devotion to his interest! The episode just proves that her predecessors showed laxity in their work and allowed Jones to blossom in her chosen work! She got in as a weed in a garden and survived to be a dominant plant!

Balakrishna Shenoy, Mr., at 4:40 pm EDT on April 28, 2007

liars are not leaders

I can’t believe that anyone would defend this poser Dean of Admissions. It’s great that she did her job well, but she should not have lied (and so egregiously, I might add) in order to get the job in the first place. Who else deserved that first job but was pushed out because of her fake/amazing credentials?

Yes, there is a stigma against people who don’t have advanced degrees in higher education. Yes, it’s especially tough for women to break into jobs in higher ed. Yes, that is all a shame. But you know what? It’s a competitive world. And just because it tougher for us women, I never lied about my degrees. Instead, I worked hard and got three degrees and compete just like everybody else.

I resent anyone that has gotten a job based on fraudulent credentials.

Would you advise students to lie on their admissions applications if they promised to do a really good job later in school? Puh-lease.

Midwest Prof, Associate Professor, at 9:10 pm EDT on April 28, 2007

Unearned status

I agree that a degree does not a good worker make; however, as a student being told by university personnel that a post-secondary degree is essential for higher achievement in the world, I want the personnel in those university positions to have gone through the procedures that they purport to be essential.

Jayne, at 8:50 am EDT on April 30, 2007

“My, my, how threatening it must be to those who haven’t succeeded. . .”

You’re making some assumptions with this one. I’d assume most of the people posting here are profs or grad students; I’m willing to bet most could have obtained the first job that she did if they had wanted it and while I intend this as offense to no one, I’m sure you could even find some people in the thread who would be angry if they had to quit their current jobs to take up what she left behind.

——

I’d have more sympathy for her if I was certain she merely told one lie 30 years ago. But if she was willing to lie about something this big (and especially if she was then able to get away with it) I really doubt she was hesitant about telling a lot of smaller ones in the course of getting to her current position.

A ton of people massage their resumes a little bit. A ton of people play up their abilities a little bit in job interviews. To see somebody lying about having a bachelors and a graduate degree & implying that she has a doctorate when she merely took a few courses in college. . . and to conclude that this person is just playing the game is pretty warped if ya honestly think this. This is well beyond resume-massaging. It’s not the norm for anybody — people have always been fired for lying about much less.

If somebody’s engaged in lying anywhere close to this level, they aren’t playing anybody’s game (if you disagree, feel free to inform your boss and see what he does to you), they’re engaged in fraud and stealing a job from somebody who actually deserves it.

SB, at 8:15 pm EDT on April 30, 2007

What really happened I wonder!

I wonder who phoned in the information that led MIT to investigate Marilee Jones. Why did this happen? Many blogs have said that her political enemies were extremely worried about her being successful in knocking the Ivy League Transparency door down.

And

I recall some time ago when Princeton Admissions director broke into the Yale computer system in part to see where one of the Bush relatives was going to school the Dean was retired early and the director was reassigned to human resources. MIT did not reassign her. Why is everyone cmoplaining about MIT?

Hedoyo, at 4:05 pm EDT on May 13, 2007