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A Very Scary Story

May 17, 2007

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In the aftermath of the Virginia Tech shootings and revelations about the killer’s violent writings, creative writing faculty everywhere faced a stark reminder of the occupational hazards they face in distinguishing fiction from potentially scary fact, in cultivating an atmosphere fostering free expression and creativity while maintaining standards not only of art, but also of safety. The challenges inherent in that process have proven to be anything but abstract at San Jose State University, where a lecturer opted to stop teaching his creative writing class in April after receiving a disturbing student assignment.

Mitch Berman, director of San Jose State’s Center for Literary Arts, spoke with the provost April 23 about a story turned in prior to the April 16 Virginia Tech shootings, Pat Harris, a university spokeswoman, said Wednesday. The university police department ultimately determined the student did not pose a threat, but several of the remaining class meetings for the undergraduate fiction course were canceled, with two substitute instructors from the English department teaching the balance of classes this semester.

The story -- described by the student newspaper as "a 17-page fictional narrative about an English student who convinces a vampire lover to kill the student's 'unethical, wicked' professor -- features, of course a fictionalized professor whose quotes are so similar to Berman's that, as he said, "the students and I recognized my portrayal in them."

"The student's story created a great deal of anxiety, and several other students wrote me during the aftermath of the shooting at Virginia Tech (the story was written before the shooting) to question their own safety in the classroom. I view my primary responsibility as that of maintaining a safe environment that is conducive to learning. It was clear that the student's story had created an atmosphere of conflict in the classroom which would make learning very difficult," Berman said via e-mail. To alleviate the "atmosphere of conflict," Berman proposed either teaching the course online or hiring a substitute (the students, he said, ultimately favored the latter option).

"I've been teaching full-time for 10 years. I've received many gory stories and stories that were not to my taste," he added in a telephone interview Wednesday night. But this particular piece, he said, "crossed every conceivable line including lines I didn't know were there."

"Nobody has ever created a character based on me that has come to any harm at all," Berman said -- adding that he thinks the university's response serves as a key early test of academe's ability to adjust to the realities of a post-Virginia Tech world.

"Of course episodes like the one concerning Professor Berman are quite rare," Scott Rice, chair of San Jose State's English & Comparative Literature Department, said in an e-mail Wednesday. "On the odd occasion that a writing instructor receives a disturbing paper, it usually involves a student who seems suicidal. Our practice is to refer such a student to Counseling Services, sometimes even taking the precaution of walking the student over to insure that he or she does receive help."

"In the Berman case we thought that the likelihood of violence was very slim; nevertheless, we chose to err on the side of caution and arrange for a substitute," Rice continued. "The arrangement seems to have worked out well for all parties concerned. We have to wonder if the Virginia Tech episode will not inspire a wave of psychological copycatting -- students confecting violent narratives just to pull their instructors' strings."

Three different units within the university – academic affairs, counseling services and the university police department – responded to the situation, Harris said. Upon interviewing the student and the professor, the police department found that the student had not broken any laws. “We still did our best to accommodate the professor’s concerns of course, but in the professional judgment of counseling services and the university police department, the student was not a danger to himself or anyone else,” Harris said.

Alan Soldofsky, director of creative writing at San Jose State, declined to comment on the particulars of the incident, but said via e-mail that the university’s creative writing faculty have had informal discussions about the issues at stake, and pointed out that the Academic Senate has conducted a more formal review of campus procedures in the case of a student emergency. In general, Soldofsky wrote he would be inclined to err on the side of caution in light of the Virginia Tech shootings. “However, by taking student writing seriously when it contains threats of violence -- direct or implied -- to another member of the university community (student, faculty, or staff member), does give an individual student the power to intimidate instructors with whom he or she may have disagreements or to seek attention from the instructor or from class members in disruptive and negative ways," he said.

“As for my own point of view, I see creative writing not so much as a form of self-expression (or in the case of problem students, acting out), but of learning to express one's 'otherness,' in the sense of being able to use one's imagination to devise stories or poems out of, as Keats called it, one's 'negative capability.' That is the ability not to be yourself and not to put your own limited self-interested point of view into one's creative writing. And to hold contradictory emotions and ideas together in your mind at once without judgment. To be as Emily Dickinson called it ‘a nobody.’”

“In that sense, a threat of violence directed specifically toward a member of the university community in a creative writing class represents a student's failure of imagination, and should be seen as cry for help or cry for attention,” Soldofsky said, describing the need of the instructor in that case to judge the correct course of action to protect him/herself and the students (with the guidance and support, he added, of the institution). “But of course,” Soldofsky said, “the individual student's rights must also be considered and be protected, up to the point when that individual student's story or poem violates the rights of others.”

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Comments on A Very Scary Story

  • psychology continued
  • Posted by mqs on May 17, 2007 at 7:50am EDT
  • (sorry I clicked in the wrong place from previous attempt at comment)

    If a person makes a credible threat of violence, that person should be held responsible. However, it seems the target of the threat generally is the one who has to run and hide out instead until the one who acted dangerously actually "does something" however that may be defined. For further consultation, I suggest a visit to battered women's shelters &c.

  • Who makes the decision?
  • Posted by Michael Chiaradonna on May 17, 2007 at 9:15am EDT
  • I was particularly taken back by the quote of Scott Rice, Chair of San Jose State's English & Comparative Literature Department, "In the Berman case we thought that the liklihood of violence was very slim ...."

    Who is "we"?

    In the Virginia Tech massacre, it appears(at least based on what has been reported to the media)that decisions -faulty ones- were made after the two killings in the dorm.

    What's not clear is whether those decisions (i.e., to not do anything other than to lock down that specific dorm and carry on business as usual and use "domestic problem" as the catchall rationale of excusing a more reasonable response) were administrative and, consequently, more PR-based than crisis intervention decisions.

    Or, were those decisions the result of administrators, counselors, psychologists, specially-trained police, and others who look at the circumstances of a crime -indeed a double-murder, and evaluate and decide without the voice or veto of administrators?

    To date, that has not been made clear.

    Schools, be it primary, secondary, or higher education, are social institutions were people gather for, ostensibly, academic endeavors. However, within that gathering the caveats, nuances, and yes, craziness of humanity are ever present.

    It is expected -and necessary- that those in leadership roles are acutely aware of the troublesome possibilities that can suddenly arise where people gather and ensure that safety is the primary concern in planning and decision-making.

  • Have we learned from Va Tech?
  • Posted by Concerned on May 17, 2007 at 9:15am EDT
  • I appreciate this story in the sense that we are now able to discuss how to handle "troubled" or threatening students in the classroom. However, the story did not cover what action was taken toward the student. I am glad to hear that the faculty member was allowed to be dismissed from the classroom, but it seems to me that the students who continue coming to class could still be in harm's way.

  • Mind games, play ignorance
  • Posted by Pauline C.P. on May 17, 2007 at 10:10am EDT
  • Although I don't doubt the professionalism shown by the Counseling services & police who say that this student didn't seem to pose any threat, let us not forget, in many cases, it'll be TOO LATE to talk about earlier tell- tale signs of a troubled person. After such events like the one at VA, why do we see some people feel 'shocked' by the behavior of the gunman and why do some people feel 'I knew it!' People feel 'shocked' because they never see it coming...they never knew it was THAT bad.

    Indeed, Counseling services and the police may have questioned the student, talk to her/him, and then felt he/she is not a threat. But, could it be possible that this student is good at playing ignorance? Good actor? I am not saying this student is a psychopath, but in most cases, someone who is could be very smart, knows how to play mind games, and conceal all possible indication --- and like I said earlier, by the time something bad happens, it is already TOO LATE. Prevention is better than cure!!!

    It is a good personal choice for the instructor who chose to leave, in this case. You just can't teach or walk into a classroom thinking you're always the next 'target.'

  • Do not take creative writing courses
  • Posted by Larry on May 17, 2007 at 10:40am EDT
  • What is scary about this, is that the schools are essentially telling students not to take creative writing courses. Schools need to be very clear that “creative” writing is bounded by limits on what individual professors (or anyone that happens to read their works) find spooky.

    When this first started happening, I wrote emails to all of my friends and family members with college-age kids (or who are college-age, themselves) and told them not to take creative writing courses. I urge everyone to do this as well.The risk of being blackballed and having your life ruined is too great. There is no telling what people will consider overly spooky.

  • Imagination
  • Posted by Joseph Duemer , Professor at Clarkson University on May 17, 2007 at 11:05am EDT
  • I've taught creative writing for 25 years & have read maybe three stories that seemed to suggest a potential for violence. The incidence is very small & it is best to not allow ourselves to exaggerate the threat. The we exaggerate the actual threat, then every student who writes a violent story becomes a suspect before the fact & that suspicion would be deadly to the imagination because it would lead to censorship or self-censorship. The imagination is anarchic & immoral -- it requires the freedom to transgress. Of course, the imagination is supposed to be bounded by the practices & techniques of art.

    I think Alan Soldofsky's remarks, quoted in the last three paragraphs of the article, describe the issues involved very clearly. Of course credible threats should be taken seriously for the protection of students & faculty alike; but hysterical over-reaction will render the work of the imagination that needs to be done in creative writing classrooms impossible.

    Perhaps that is a cost that an increasingly corporate & conformist academic community is willing to pay in the name of "safety." Not me.

  • Devil's Advocate
  • Posted by Martin on May 17, 2007 at 11:15am EDT
  • While I understand the professor's caution following the writings of his student, I wonder if perhaps we are starting a "witch hunt" that will in the long run hurt creative writing. Just because I may write about the killing of someone does not mean I would kill them. If that were the case, Stephen King should be locked up somewhere for sure. Just an old liberal educator's view.

  • Pauline's America
  • Posted by Larry on May 17, 2007 at 11:30am EDT
  • Pauline, What you propose is, quite frankly, scary.

    You seem to advocate that 1) counselors refer students to the police; 2) the police question students; and 3) students that are weird be presumed to be “good actors” and taken into custody in the name of “prevention.”

    To be honest, I have seen your attitude before. Many times. Usually your kind changes your tune when someone you know is taken into custody in the middle of the night (as is often the practice) and nobody will explain why, where, or what can be done to get them out. If they do get out, they are forever branded “dangerous” just because they can comply with what you consider to be a general norm. Is this the America you want?

    (By the way, are you arguing that both students and faculty should be subject to such detention, or just students? If so, why?)

  • Posted by Elizabeth McConnell , Associate professor on May 17, 2007 at 11:40am EDT
  • What I find spooky, Larry, is the complete lack of logic in your response. Perhaps your time would be better spent in a Critical Thinking class, so that you can hone your reasoning skills!

  • take this seriously
  • Posted by Alan Cordle , Reference Librarian on May 17, 2007 at 12:00pm EDT
  • I admire the way this was handled. I am currently being threatened by creative writing faculty members at the institution where my wife used to teach. That institution won't take my complaints seriously (the written messages, emailed from campus computers, include mentions of lynchings and block boxes from downed planes -- they also name each of us). In fact, their university police officer who claimed he was handling the case turned out to be lying. He told me over the course of several months that he was working with the attorney general, and when I contacted that person, he said he knew "literally nothing" about my case. All of this is especially disconcerting because my wife and I met at Virginia Tech and know/are friends with some of Cho's professors. I do wish some media organization, such as Inside Higher Ed would do a serious investigation of my story; I have a lot of evidence. What does it take?

  • No Standards for Creative Writing?
  • Posted by West Coast Prof on May 17, 2007 at 12:10pm EDT
  • What's the educational goal of creative writing? How will students benefit from these writing assignments?

    The article quotes faculty justifications about students discovering their negative otherness (and other abstruse gobbledygook) No wonder that a few students discover a desire to kill, kill, kill, or threaten, threaten, threaten.

    Why not tell students to not write about death threats, or racism, rape, other "negative otherness?" Don't the assignments already impose limits like "no plagiarism, turn in on time, use good grammar" for the good of the students?

    As a student my writing was guided by a search for beauty and truth, like in the great authors whose literature we read.

    Perhaps professors should think more about giving assignments that will bring out the best in their students.

  • Truth & Beauty
  • Posted by Joseph Duemer , Professor at Clarkson University on May 17, 2007 at 2:25pm EDT
  • West Coast Prof, before you get to Truth & Beauty you have to go through pain and suffering. Keats knew that. But you're probably right. Creative writing probably has no place in the modern university.

    In The Varieties of Religious Experience William James discusses the category of "healthy mindedness" as a particularly American trait; if I may say so, your post is a text-book perfect example of what James was talking about.

  • In Response to Larry
  • Posted by Rebekah on May 17, 2007 at 2:30pm EDT
  • I can't believe that someone would look at this incident (and others similar, such as Cho's experience at VA Tech) and suggest that people do not take creative writing classes at all! This is ludicrous!

    Saying that is essentially the same as saying one should never fly in a plane because the risk of crashing is too great. The chances of something happening to cause a plane to crash are far too small to deprive yourself of the convenience of air travel.

    Similarly, the chances of being accused of being "too spooky" in a creative writing class are too small to deprive oneself of the experience and education of a creative writing class.

    Larry, if everyone you know who has the opportunity to take a creative writing class needs to be warned not to because they may be "too spooky" for the teacher and the class, then you may need to re-evaluate who your friends are.

    I really don't believe that is why you said what you did to your friends who have college-aged children and who are college-aged themselves, but whatever your reasons, I don't believe they were completely thought-out or well-founded.

  • Giving students undue power?
  • Posted by Jake , Graduate Student at UC-San Diego on May 17, 2007 at 2:30pm EDT
  • One worrisome aspect of this, when I read about it, is that the student seems to have succeeded in getting an undesired instructor replaced through what amounts to intimidation. Certainly we should take threats of violence seriously, but do we really want to live in such fear of our students that we allow them to terrorize us? The student-teacher relationship can definitely be prone to friction, and there are already an awful lot of ways for power to be abused on both sides -- do we need one more?

  • Posted by Henry on May 17, 2007 at 3:10pm EDT
  • If Stephen King was starting out in college now, and took a creative writing course - what do you think would happen to him? :-)

  • What is our obligation to students?
  • Posted by West Coast Prof on May 17, 2007 at 3:40pm EDT
  • In my post above, I didn't say that creative writing has no place at college. I was asking instead why creative writing assignments ometimes have no guiding limits for content as they do for format. If we ask students to focus on their worst fantasies, then let's not be surprised when some students act out those fantasies that we have helped foster.

    Joseph suggests that my viewpoint is a distinctly American "healthy-mindedness,'in William James' phrase. Perhaps so, as a first-generation American I'm happy (and healthily so!) to have assimilated quickly. My family fled totalitarian nations where evil-seeking nihilist ideas misled nations into genocide and war. As intellectuals we should understand that ideas have power.

    Why do we have students in our classes? Are they there to pay our salaries through tuition? to be experimental subjects? to become romantic objects? to be persuaded to share our political views? to provide the teaching load so we can teach our scholarly specialty? The assessment movement on campuses is forcing faculty to examine what benefits students are actually obtaining from their classes.

    I'm not in the humanities but I believe that a creative writing class should improve students' literary skill. To do that does not require that they delve into the dangerous or obscene. The course is not a therapy class aimed at showing students how evil or perverted they can become. Some instructors may think that such painful exposure is a necessary milestone on the path to great writing. That formula is an empirical question open to research, but I'm sure that most English professors do not have the training to handle the psychological problems that this unguided assignment may create.

    So in my newly American optimism, I reiterate that faculty should think more about their goals and obligations to the young people at those desks. Ideas have power.

  • collected responses
  • Posted by Larry on May 17, 2007 at 5:05pm EDT
  • Rebekah, First of all, I don’t really like that you insult my friends. All of them are from “good” families, but some of them don’t really like to conform to traditional norms of society. So, they act a little different, in a lawful manner. People on here are clamoring for MORE analysis of creative writing works in order to determine who constitutes a “threat.” There is a very real risk of people being singled out. The more analysis, the more risk. The more people picking out a story, the greater risk of unwanted attention.

    I have a bit of trouble responding to the rest of your query because I am not sure what are asking. However, many people (on here) seem to view descriptions of the plots of main-stream movies, books (as Henry points out), and songs as “troubling.”

    The sad part of all of this is that I think creative writing is an important skill – even if you are not planning on being a “creative” writer.

    Ms. McConnell, People on here seem to be agreeing (Henry) and disagreeing (e.g. Rebekah) with me. (Fair enough.) However, you are the only one to simply insult me, and tell me that my response lacked “logic.’ You elected not to provide any specifics. Therefore, it would seem that you just don’t like me, but concede the merits of my points.

  • S. King
  • Posted by Buzz on May 17, 2007 at 5:05pm EDT
  • " .. If Stephen King was starting out in college .. and took a creative writing course — what do you think would happen .."

    * Receive F-grades for the proper use of grammar, correct spelling?

    * Considered weird for having a hetero-normative relationship?

    * Penalized for text length?

    * Shunned for being working-class?

  • Scary Story Is Very Familiar
  • Posted by Kelly , Associate Professor of English on May 17, 2007 at 8:10pm EDT
  • I had something very similar happen to me two years ago, with a student (an adult male student; I am a woman) who wrote increasingly disturbing work and then wrote a poem in which the title character was clearly me. The speaker in the poem sexually violated the daughter of the professor-character (I have a young daughter; in the poem, she was aged to her early teens). I asked the university to do a psychological evaluation on the student; they could not find grounds to warrant that. He was then removed from my class, because the university couldn't figure out what else to do, and thereafter the student contacted the local national media, who gave his case some coverage. After many discussions and due to a fear of a lawsuit, my institution let him back into class with about three weeks before finals. I received some sense of protection vis-a-vis two other professors who co-taught my class for the rest of the semester, with myself as an essential observer. The student received no other disciplinary sanction, continued taking classes, and eventually failed out of school due to low grades, warranted by his erratic behavior in other courses. All the while, he was quite proud of what he did to me and the other students in my class, telling everyone who would listen what an awful person I was.

    In addition, I received threatening phone calls from various conservative individuals around the country, and was harrassed by the news media, because the student decided to frame the story (completely erroneously) as a case of racial discrmination by a white, liberal professor (me) against a mixed-race, conservative student (him). There wasn't too much I could do without fueling things even more, so I mostly stayed quiet, which allowed his fantasy take on the situation to be published. I regret that, but at the time I was thinking of my family and wanted everything to just go away.

    I have taught creative writing for many years--it is my degree area--and have had many mentally ill students, but this was the first who threatened the class environment in any way, and who involved me personally in his work. That was really the issue--the feeling that I was being directly threatened (or rather, my family was). To make a very long and traumatic story short, no, creative writing is not automatically a site wherein students are or should be persecuted for writing unusual or provocative things. But it can be a site for unbalanced students to cross boundaries and put themselves, their classmates, or their professor in danger. Until we consider creative writing a "real" college course (and I put that in quotes, because we seem to allow all kinds of behavior in CW courses that we would not allow elsewhere in the academy) and take these students' threats--or cries for help--absolutely seriously, we will see more cases like the one above, and they will not always turn out well.

  • Try reality?
  • Posted by L.L. on May 18, 2007 at 6:45am EDT
  • " .. we will see more cases like the one above, and they will not always turn out well .."

    As a former court reporter and writer (not an oxymoron) -- IMHO, one of the best reality-based suggestions from the VT tragedy was to require students to authentically consider the outcomes of their writing.

    Not video games -- visit a morgue. A shoorting scene. Mothers of murder victims. When actually confronting the outcome of violence, and the tears and emotional trauma -- it is no longer a video game.

  • Sorry To Weigh In So Late
  • Posted by RWH on May 18, 2007 at 6:50am EDT
  • As usual, I read everything ... report/essay plus all of the comments.

    It’s obvious that some of Larry’s critics misunderstand his perspective ... although he seems to have stated it once and repeated it twice. Larry is not advising his friends and his friends’ children to eschew creative writing classes because they will be inhabited by seriously disturbed young men (or women) who put the teacher and fellow students at risk. I assume we all know actions like those of Seung-Hui Cho are very, very low probability events. He is, however, telling them to avoid those classes because – as we have seen in a remarkable number of debates like this one – they will be inhabited by a shockingly large number of individuals who are prepared to justify and practice some combination of anti-intellectualism and anti-free speech ... all in the name of protecting themselves and others. It is also part of Larry’s argument that these “protectors of academe” seem to be quite willing to carry out their agendas with little regard for the long-term well-being of those being charged (in a very, very high probability sense) with nothing more than taking risks in a creative writing class. Hmmm ... let’s send this one to Jon Stewart.

    Larry can certainly handle his own debates, but I can’t resist responding to Elizabeth McConnell’s recommendation that “[his] time would be better spent in a Critical Thinking class, so that you can hone your reasoning skills!”

    Frankly – and quite independent of Larry’s needs -- that advice is laughable ... and in a manner that is consistent with the anti-intellectualism to which I alluded earlier. Starting three decades ago, every social scientist with a knowledge of statistics at the level of a sophomore statistics major found it irresistible to call themselves “Statisticians” and offer wonderfully mediocre courses in “statistics” in-house ... anything to spare themselves and their students the unnecessary rigor expected of those who set foot in a mathematics or statistics course.

    During the past decade – and especially in response to the ethical lapses of business men and women across the land – every business school in the U.S. began offering courses in ethics ... taught, of course, by one of their old-timers whose knowledge of philosophy and religion would, if the students were lucky, fill a thimble.

    And now, in response to the ubiquitous nature of irrational thought and illogical arguments amongst those who make their livings as writers – and I take as just one bit of supportive evidence the fact that Noam Chomsky is the world’s number one living public intellectual – practically every English department (and business school) in the land has discovered the necessity for teaching a course in something called “critical thinking.” And isn’t it remarkable that one of their own happens to be wonderfully qualified to teach the course and even write papers about the subject.

    For more about this nonsense, go to ...

    http://www.insidehighered.com/news/2007/03/30/mla

    and read the posts by RWH and JBM. There you will find, “Those books [about critical thinking] were nothing but the most pathetic presentations of very elementary logic, mathematics, and statistics – pretty much at the level that any 9th grade student with a competent teacher could master in a month or so – and with remarkably weak attempts to marry the “theory” to some sort of substance.”

    Critical thinking, indeed!

  • Mental Illness
  • Posted by Joseph Duemer , Professor at Clarkson University on May 18, 2007 at 8:45am EDT
  • Kelly, you say you have taught "many students with mental illness." How many? Over how long a period? I ask because I have been teaching CW for 25 years & could count the number of students in my classes who appeared obviously mentally ill enough for me to be concerned for them on the fingers of one hand. Perhaps you have an overly capacious definition of mental illness.

  • Posted by Kelly on May 18, 2007 at 9:40am EDT
  • I probably spoke too broadly--I can think of at least 5 students who had very visible mental illness (manifested in various ways). I have seen others who were clearly suffering from depression--which I would not want to classify as anything dangerous or threatening in this context, but as something which has been an issue visible in students' writing or their conferences with me. I only wanted to make the point that yes, I have seen CW classes attract students who need help, in one way or another, but up until my incident with this student, I did not feel the need to take any action. Sorry if that wasn't clear in my earlier post.

  • To Joseph Duemer ...
  • Posted by RWH on May 18, 2007 at 9:55am EDT
  • You have been teaching for 25 years. I can add my 47 years of teaching to yours and reach precisely the conclusions you did in your three posts to this article.

    In that time, the worst things I have encountered in the classroom are (1) a few students I would classify as having a level of anger more than two standard deviations above the mean, (2) a very, very few rude students and (3) 6,781 students with self-diagnosed “math anxiety.”

  • What is the Mission of a College?
  • Posted by John Lobell , Professor at Pratt Institute on May 18, 2007 at 12:05pm EDT
  • It seems to me that tying the Virginia Tech killings to the student’s creative writing misses the real issue.

    In addition to the student’s creative writing, he engaged in overt acts which brought him to the attention of Virginia Tech student affairs, Virginia Tech security, local police, and a local mental hospital.

    It was obvious that his condition made his own education impossible, and also egregiously interfered with the education of other students.

    The fact that such was not grounds for his suspension from the school is an indication that colleges no longer view their mission as education, but rather to be a laboratory for trendy social theories.

  • Imagination, etc.
  • Posted by Joseph Duemer , Professor at Clarkson University on May 18, 2007 at 12:10pm EDT
  • I suppose it's possible that there is a correlation between imagination & creativity on the one hand and depression, anxiety, even "mental illness" on the other, but it is a loose correlation at best. Are there really more unstable students in CW classes than in Political Science classes? (A lot of those students want to be lawyers, itself a form of mental illness!) The arts in general tend to attract people who are less conformist than the norm in their thinking & behavior. But some "statistician" ought to go back over the last fifty years & count all the incidents of serious campus violence, then correlate that to the academic department or course of study of the perpetrators. I would lay good odds that the relationship would be random.

  • Posted by Larry on May 18, 2007 at 12:30pm EDT
  • RWH, Strangely, I think med school and law school are DESIGNED to drive people somewhat crazy. But, we like it that way.

  • Me, too
  • Posted by Homer on May 18, 2007 at 7:00pm EDT
  • " .. I received threatening phone calls from various conservative individuals .."

    Me, too -- from various liberal individuals. Threatened violence if they didn't get their way. Frightening.

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=VAtUz7JM7TI

  • Irrelevant
  • Posted by Joaseph Duemer , Professor at Clarkson University on May 20, 2007 at 9:20am EDT
  • Homer's post (just above) & its link are irrelevant to this discussion and should not have been posted by the editors. It is clearly an attempt -- a clumsy & intellectually dishonest attempt -- to steer the discussion and attention to another matter that has nothing to do with creative writing classes. It is an attempt to hijack this discussion for political purposes & to publicize the video link.

    It just occurred to me that maybe there is connection. The video records Chris Simcox, the christo-racist paramilitary anti-immigration activist being shouted down at SMU. Homer is suggesting, perhaps, that if Chris Simcox were in charge we would have never let the Virgina Tech murderer into the country, since he was a Korean immigrant. Ironically, people like Simcox and Cho Hui Seung believe in solving their problems in the same way.

  • Irrelevant (II)
  • Posted by Homer on May 20, 2007 at 1:40pm EDT
  • " .. It just occurred to me that maybe there is connection."

    Wrong -- again (and again, and again ..).

    The aforementioned is well-known for his utterly-predictable, knee-jerk, one-sided politicized writings. Those writings help make the case for David Horowitz, SAF, ACTA, FIRE, et al.

    Keep it up! Mr. Horowitz appreciates your efforts!

  • My Exalted Reputation
  • Posted by Joseph Duemer , Professor at Clarkson University on May 20, 2007 at 10:30pm EDT
  • The aforementioned is well-known for his utterly-predictable, knee-jerk, one-sided politicized writings.

    Homer gives me far too much credit. I am not at all well known. He also misuses the word "aforementioned" (no one mentioned me before) and abuses the passive voice. His response calls not only his intellectual honesty but his literacy into question. Nor does he actually respond to my charge of irrelevance, choosing instead to divert attention from his attempt to hijack this discussion in favor of, well, abusing the passive voice & dragging the creepy little Stalinist David Horowitz into the discussion. QED, as we say in the academy.

  • Correction
  • Posted by Homer on May 21, 2007 at 8:40am EDT
  • " .. I am not at all well known."

    Yes, correct. I am too easy-going. You're not well-known -- much less well-considered. Sorry.

    " .. He also misuses the word “aforementioned” (no one mentioned me before) .."

    Yeah, that's blog-software for you. I would have corrected it, but for the software -- and, unfortunately, life has gone on.

    BTW: instead of constantly complaining -- why not get a student to fix this software issue? And perhaps be well-considered?

    " .. dragging the creepy little Stalinist David Horowitz into the discussion .."

    Oh, yes. No one is smarter or better than thee. Mr. Horowitz, I, and everyone else should be on bended knee to accept thy brilliance. Versus the hundreds of thousands of MFAs and PhDs in the job market.

    Keep it up! ACTA, Mr. Horowitz, FrontPageMag.com, LittleGreenFootballs.com SAF, FIRE, et al., love the ability of objective, even-handed and wide-band thinkers like yourself to help them raise money! Good job!

  • A Prosthesis Will Not Be Necessary
  • Posted by Frizbane Manley on May 21, 2007 at 10:20am EDT
  • Elizabeth:

    I am not in favor of censorship ... but neither am I in favor of adults behaving either childishly or irrationally. Perhaps you are willing to have this discussion end, but if the patient can be saved at all, I think an amputation is required.

    I suggest you go up to the last post by Larry, amputate (delete) the clearly gangrenous appendage that dangles down from there and see if that will inspire more thoughtful input.

    [Disclaimer: The author of this post may have accessed Wikipedia within the past 24 hours]

  • Prosthesis (II)
  • Posted by Homer on May 22, 2007 at 8:40am EDT
  • " .. I am not in favor of censorship .. I suggest you .. amputate (delete)

    .. anything that disagrees with the world-view of Noam Chomsky, Ward Churchill, Teddy Kennedy, Howard Dean, Michael Moore, Al Franken, Hiliary Clinton, et al.

    But I'm not for censorship ..

    Or, end this at this point, for a more perfect world:

    Larry, at 5:05 pm EDT on May 17, 2007

  • Prosthesis (III)
  • Posted by Frizbane Manley on May 22, 2007 at 9:35am EDT
  • ” ..but neither am I in favor of adults behaving either childishly or irrationally”

    Thanks Homer, for helping me make my point ... no, for decidedly making my point.

    Any why did you mention that strange assortment of people? ... friends of yours?

    Oh, by the way, even though I’ve stooped to be waaaaay down here, I’m still voting for deletion of stupidity ... everything below Larry’s post.

    [Disclaimer: The author of this post may have accessed Wikipedia within the past 24 hours]

  • Prosthesis (IV)
  • Posted by Homer on May 22, 2007 at 8:20pm EDT
  • " .. Oh, by the way, even though I’ve stooped to be waaaaay down here, I’m still voting for deletion of stupidity ... everything below Larry’s post."

    Gosh -- thanks for agreeing with me, Mr. Einstein.

    " .. Or, end this at this point, for a more perfect world: Larry, at 5:05 pm EDT on May 17, 2007 .."

    You so smart. I hope your assistant dean treats you appropriately. You are a natural for the freshman orientation committee.

  • You guys are too much...
  • Posted by Stephen on June 18, 2007 at 12:45pm EDT
  • I don't know too much about the situation, but have you guys read the darn story yet? Don't make any judgments until you know both sides.