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Relative Advantages of Associate Degrees and Certificates

January 22, 2009

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WASHINGTON -- Many of the findings produced by a new in-depth study of the educational and employment outcomes of low-income students fell into the category, as the researcher Louis S. Jacobson described them, of "the truths your mother told you" -- in other words, they mostly confirmed widely held suppositions about the links between education and work force success. Being from a low-income background hurts students' chances of educational progress. Those who struggle in high school tend to fare less well in college and beyond. The further one advances educationally, the better one fares economically. Taking courses in fields that pay well tends to produce higher wages.

But the study, which was conducted by the research organization CNA and the Hudson Institute and financed by the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, also promulgated some findings that challenged the status quo, especially in suggesting that low-income students who struggle in high school get more of an earnings boost by earning a certificate than they do achieving an associate degree at a two-year college.

Although some leading higher education researchers invited to respond to the study warned against a sweeping embrace of that conclusion, citing limitations in the data, they also cited the report -- which was based on data produced by the State of Florida's unusual system for linking its citizens' education and employment records -- as evidence of the need for many more states to create such data systems, an idea that is building steam but still opposed in some quarters for privacy reasons.

"Increasingly in this economy, some form of postsecondary education and training, degreed or not, is the prerequisite for middle class earnings now," said Anthony P. Carnevale, research professor and director of Georgetown University's Center on Education and the Workforce. The only way to truly understand what sorts of education produces the best economic outcomes, he said, is "to understand the connection between what happens in the schools, particularly postsecondary, and what goes on in the labor market. Integrating educational and economic data to track outcomes, Carnevale said, "seems like a small and geeky thing, but it isn't."

The study, "Pathways to Boosting the Earnings of Low-Income Students by Increasing Their Educational Attainment," was the subject of a half-day forum Wednesday at the Hudson Institute's office here. The researchers presented their findings and then -- to their credit -- let some highly respected researchers from a range of perspectives take their turns critiquing it.

By tapping into the rich reams of student data produced by Florida's longitudinal records system -- which examine 225,000 students who were in public high schools in 1996 and follow them through 2007 -- the authors are able to show how students from a range of economic backgrounds flow through that state's public colleges and into its work force, to see "what actually happened to them," said Diana Furchgott-Roth, a senior fellow at the Hudson Institute and co-author of the study. (The data are limited to those students who attended public high schools and stayed within Florida for college.)

Much of what they found reaffirms concerns that arise whenever policy makers look at the success of students from low-income backgrounds in higher education. Among their findings:

  • Access to college depends heavily on students' financial backgrounds. Only 55 percent of students who qualified for free and reduced lunch (a federal proxy for low family income) attended college, compared to 62 percent of other students. Twenty-five percent of free and reduced lunch students attended college within two years (compared to 39 percent of other students) and 17 percent completed a year's worth of college, compared to 30 percent. Non-free and reduced lunch students were also more than twice as likely as their less-wealthy peers to earn a college credential within six years.
  • High school grades also appear to have a significant influence on college outcomes. Of students who earned an A average in high school and attended college within two years of graduation, 52 percent earned a B.A. or graduate degree, 17 percent a certificate or associate degree, and 31 percent no credential at all. A full 82 percent of C students who entered college within two years earned no credential. In addition, students with a C average were significantly likelier to attend community colleges than were those with A averages in high school.
  • Those who achieved a higher credential earned more money. Students who earned a certificate had median earnings that were 27 percent higher than than those with no college credential; those with a bachelor's degree earned about 35 percent more than those with no credential; and those with graduate degrees made about 62 percent more. Interestingly, though, students with just an A.A. degree did only 8 percent better than those with no credential at all -- quite a bit less well than those with certificates.
  • Student earnings varied greatly by discipline, most acutely for those with certificates and associate degrees. The median income for students in health-related fields was higher than the 75th percentile for all other fields, including the so-called STEM fields (science, technology, engineering and math) and professional fields such as communications and management. (Among bachelor's degree earners, the fields were much more closely grouped, except for the humanities, which lagged.)

The finding that students who earned certificates earned more than those with an associate degree, and another suggesting that students who earned a C in high school were only slightly less likely than A students to earn a credential in health-related and other higher-paying fields, were arguably the most surprising of the study. "Together these two results suggest that it is feasible for students who attend two-year colleges and do not go on to complete four-year programs to increase their earnings substantially by completing the courses needed to obtain a certificate," the study's authors wrote.

Jacobson, of CNA (which is known for this kind of work because of its extensive experience crunching huge data systems for the military), said the study was not designed to argue that students should be directed toward more-practical certificate programs rather than the more academic liberal arts disciplines at community colleges.

"All we’re trying to do is find what C students can do most productively at the point they leave high school," he said. "The investments we’re currently making in the two-year-college system are extremely important, and the message that comes across very clearly is that too many students are leaving high school without having a terrific high school experience, then are going to community colleges and repeating some mistakes they've already made."

The experts who analyzed the Hudson study seemed most intrigued by the finding on certificates. Chester B. Finn, Jr., president of the Thomas B. Fordham Foundation, said that to people like him "who tend to focus only on degrees," the findings about the earnings value of community college certificates suggested "evidence that better information regarding postsecondary possibilities might boost the prospects of low-income students."

But that finding also raised significant questions and cautions. Thomas Bailey, the George and Abby O'Neill Professor of Economics and Education and director of the Community College Research Center at Columbia University Teachers College, said it was unfair to compare recipients of certificates -- which in many cases are a student's ultimate educational goal -- with those who've achieved associate degrees, particularly in fields such as the humanities.

Most students who end up with only an associate degree in English or comparable fields do so "either because they stumbled into it, didn't know what they would do, were misinformed, or didn't complete their goals," Bailey said. "There is very little return to a student who has an English associate degree, and that's it." The pool of people who get associate degrees in non-technical fields and don't go on to transfer to a four-year college, Bailey noted, is very small.

In many ways, the assembled experts said, the study's specific findings were less important than the promise that such data-driven studies hold for policy makers -- if they can get their hands on good longitudinal data like those from Florida. But that will be impossible unless more states -- often over the objections of college officials -- begin stitching together data from the elementary and secondary schools, postsecondary education systems, and work force agencies, said Georgetown's Carnevale.

Many private college officials, backed by leading Republican lawmakers, have blocked efforts to create a federal student records system, citing privacy concerns. But the Education Department has begun funding state efforts to build their own, and the stimulus package that Congress is now considering would contain as much as $250 million in additional funds for such efforts.

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Comments on Relative Advantages of Associate Degrees and Certificates

  • Income level and type of postsecondary education
  • Posted by feudi pandola on January 22, 2009 at 8:05am EST
  • This study makes intuitive sense when you look at the jobs produced within the certificate or diploma sector of higher ed, compared to the jobs that require an associate degree. As the article commented, an associate degree in English really adds little to one's earning potential. Compare that to a 2 year diploma in registered nursing that will lead to a job earning over $60,000 within one year. The same analogy holds for electricians, carpenters, and many other technology-based certificate programs.

    The abysmal completion rates nationally for two year associate degree programs tell me that higher ed is not providing people the education that they need to be successful in the current economy.

    Something is wrong with the model. It has become disconnected from the society it is supposed to serve. It must be fixed.

  • A.A. degrees in English
  • Posted by Dean Dad on January 22, 2009 at 8:46am EST
  • In my observation, most students who get AA degrees in liberal arts disciplines do so with the intention of transferring to a four-year college. I've literally never heard a student say that the goal was to get a two-year degree in a humanities area and then stop.

    Comparing the earning potential of a completed certificate to the earning potential of a truncated transfer program is really apples and oranges.

  • Cooling out at the CC
  • Posted by Glen S. McGhee , Dir., at Florida Higher Education Accountability Project on January 22, 2009 at 8:51am EST
  • While this study certainly sets a higher standard for the utilization of student records and for longitudinal studies, particularly in terms of post-graduation pathways, it lacks broader social and economic context.

    For example, much of the previous literature reviewed seems to assume that all graduating students, whether from high school or college, immediately enter the labor force, and that their employment positions are linked in some way with course majors, etc. All of these assumptions are questionable, and skew perception of the postsecondary pipeline.

    There is no way to tell if employment followed from credentials, or if credentials merely increased earnings in a job already held in Figures 12 and 14.

    For example, Figure 12 on median earnings/credential correlation fails to give a sense of the density of the distribution of these over the range of students, and also gives the mistaken impression of full employment. Any subsequent discussion about credential differentials needs to take this into account. It is just as possible that being over-qualified also works to undermine any credential effect, and this needs to be quantified.

    Rather than looking at "the effect of specific college courses on subsequent earnings," it may be helpful to take Florida's unemployment insurance data and work backward. But the problem with this is that even this approach assumes full employment. The study itself notes issues like this. In addition, there is no attempt to operationalize the "overschooling" problem, or put it in its economic context.

    Figure 6 doesn't break out certificate or other non-degree program attendance, but Figure 7 and especially Figure 9 show how the education pipeline is successful at "cooling out" junior college students as opposed to 4 year students in Figure 10. Also especially see Figure 22.

  • Not so fast, my friends
  • Posted by Pastè Boul on January 22, 2009 at 10:55am EST
  • The findings are not surprising as short-term results. Community college educators know this. Sometimes we lose these students to high-wage employment after one or two semesters. Unfortunately life does not stop at 20 or 25. We should wait and see what happens to the AA or AS and the AAS-degree earners when they reach forty. We could maximize the potential of these certificate earners if we can encourage them to pursue life-long learning and not fall prey of good paying jobs that may vanish with the advance of technology or a down turn in the economy.

    Pastè Boul

  • Research needs substance
  • Posted by Bob S. on January 22, 2009 at 2:15pm EST
  • What does it mean to get a 2-year degree in English? There are NO such things. To do rersearch with such a simplistic belief only leads to further misunderstandings.

    Sure there are 2-year approaches to liberal arts and goals for ultimate specific majors; many, if not most, remain unrealized or continually change.

    Very simply, jobs pay more than no jobs. Health employment pays more than most other fields. Certificates (licensure/certification) usually pay more than any degree (associate, bachelors, masters...) if in specialized areas like high tech, health, business, automotive, dental, HVAC...

    Research like this needs a lot of refinement to be of any real value. It's an outsider's look at thimgs well known by those inside the community college movement.

    Our mothers knew that higher grades would mean something; that reading was good; that actually going to school was better than not going. Mothers also knew that knowing math and science was important; reading books led to good things; finishing high school is important as is the general overall ability to read effectively, write and speak at above average levels, and so forth.

    Mothers also knew that living within a family unit was important as was eating regularly, sleeping with some consistency, not doing drugs or alcohol; not smoking...

    Do we need research to tell us what most mothers already know. We need to find out what kind of mothers do not know these things. Fix that first. Then work on dad's role in this venture!

  • Posted by Dennis Ruhl on February 1, 2009 at 11:55am EST
  • Back when I went to school students quitting after 2 years were called dropouts. Are increases in income really dependant on education or are income AND increased education products of intelligence? Someone lacking the ability or initiative to complete grade 12 is also going to lack the ability or initiative to function at a responsible and financially lucrative job.

  • HIGHER EDUCATION & SOCIOECONOMIC LEVEL
  • Posted by CECILE on February 4, 2009 at 7:55pm EST
  • When one is exposed primarily to lower expectations in the educational setting, it would seem a natural consequence that enduranc-- in places where higher expectations is part of the culture-- would suffer.

    When you have not been exposed to an achievement orientation, or have even been told that it isn't possible for you (because you are black, brown, poor), the average soul will probably believe it, make it normal.

    Hence poor skills to pursue college. Other research tells us that when students don't take four or more years of challenging math and science courses, their likelihood of success in college is limited. That's not even mentioning 4 years of solid research paper writing and essay writing.

    Mental habits, the ability to push through the cultural press of low expectations, poor grasp of multiplication tables, all that would contribute to one being more likely to pursue job training at a CC as opposed to more elaborate transfer-oreinted academic type programs.

    Yes, let's teach parents how to avoid the low expectation trap and easy k-12 courses for their children. Especially the moms.